View Full Version : Superchargers are they really worth it?
Chargers fitted to v6's without suitable gearing are they really worth the expence?
TRD supercharger?
Yes, as it's bolt on, requires not a lot of parts and gives out the box 40/50bhp.
Other superchargers, yes but you need to spend more.
What you've got would be overpriced if you needed the injectors and ECU to run it, but you don't. It's there, in your paw, away you go.
Anything else is going to require time, money, custom parts, etc.
I would judge a supercharger's value on the complete package, not just the price of the charger itself.
Also, if you can go ghetto and do the work yourself they can be cost effective.
That's the TB way.
No the article is very fine, what I mean is, that the engine has so much torque and the car is so light that with it being so (in my opinion undergeared) the charger doesn't really get a chance to function before it has reved out.
Ah right, gotcha.
You're running the E153 tubby box Chris, that should give you enough to play with.
You can always get the longer FD (as per the thread in "drivetrain").
I'm one for longer gearing to put the power in the more useable range but not too long where it hurts it. Your setup should suit the E153 ratios pretty much bob on.
You think you're changing gear too much?
I thought roots superchargers had instant grunt?
They do pretty much i think what Chris is getting at is that all that power flies through the gears due to the ratios so you're changing up lots.
If you had a longer final drive and a higher top speed for every gear you'd be accelerating for more mph but slightly slower.
It's about where the ratios put your power band compared to the mph you're doing. So if you're doing lots of low speed blasting about the short ratios box suits best, usually the N/A.
If you're doing more b-road work i'd go for NA with the ST182 final drive.
If you've got it supercharged then you've got enough power to make good use of the longer ratios on the E153.
Sometimes it's nice to have a higher max speed you're never really going to get to if it makes things more civilised at lower speeds and suits your driving.
What am saying is, short ratios are good but they're not for everybody.
Barronmr
15-01-2009, 23:57
I suppose I'm kinda qulified to answer this as I've got a supercharged mk1v6, only problem is I haven't driven a non-SC mk1v6.
The car I have has the shorter S-series NA g'box and I certainly don't find throwing it through the gears a chore :), if your in the mood for using every bit of the power then its perfectly fine. But with the sc i'd imagine it just allows that bit more grunt lowdown the rev range, so if you don't fancy that flurry of gearchanges you can just stick it in 4th and plow past everyday traffic slightly slower.
Aye but what, i think, Chris is saying is, if you've got all that power, why not have a gear range to make full use of it?
It's like a 205 Rallye, 1.3 engine and ultra short box = mega fun, racy as hell.
If you put a V8 on that box it would just be bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, you're doing 110 and that's it.
Fine for the initial acceleration but once you're up to speed you're straining the engine and it wants to sit lower down the revs so you end up cruising at 55mph cos that's where the revs and the gear ratios match.
What you want, is a gear box with a top speed of say 160mph.
That way you will use the torque to work up through the gears but when you're up to speed the engine isn't trying to pull you back down to cruising speed.
That's why i want a longer FD on the S54, it'll make my cruising and b-road runs less strained.
Your car is mental accelerating Luke, and it suits it, it's a stripped out track/sprint car. Though i reckon it would be nice to have the longer 5th gear at least for driving to and from events.
200bhp and 200lb/ft on an S54 is great.
Any more and i think it does need longer ratios.
sidewaysfreak
16-01-2009, 00:18
the noise that v6sc makes at low revs is very boomy and it doesnt max out till over 135, so it isnt too busy at 80-90, just about nice really, perfectly on the sweet spot to waste a backmarker on the A1.
Yup that's it exactly Ollie, I spend more time actually shifting the gear than actually in it and the sc certainly doesn't get enough time to develop any meaningful boost, it all happens too fast, the engine is pretty much always in the top end of the rev range. first is essentially redundent, When I think about it I'm not sure that the SC actually speeds things up much from before it was added, yes in top it does work (but not for long) because as soon as you ease off the accelerator the bypass opens and boost is lost, (so apart from full acceleration does this mean the SC causes drag?) It goes back to what I was asking before, that in veiw of the massive torque and weight of the car is it acctually worth the expense?
I thought that my 'box was not suitable for the longer top or it already had it?
If you think the gearing isn't right on a tubby box then what do people think about the s/c on an a/n box :freak3:
sidewaysfreak
16-01-2009, 18:48
The red v6sc that Luke has just bought has a supercharged 3vz on a N/A box and it really isn't that bad. What size wheels/tyres are you running? The red one has 245/35 17's on the rear IIRC and it goes through the gears like this (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=YkZsP1op_hc), granted it doesn't spend too long in each gear but my brothers skyline has about half that time in each gear.
My wheels are "15 I forget the size tyres but the diameter is same as standard so's not to affect the speedo.
sidewaysfreak
16-01-2009, 20:54
If it's a mk2 box in a mk1, you need mk2 tyre sizes to keep the speedo correct I think.
I thought that my 'box was not suitable for the longer top or it already had it?
It does have long gearing on the E153 tubby box but Johnny was looking at a longer final drive or 5th gear for his beastie.
Check out the drivetrain section, it's all in there.
As pokey as a supercharged V6 in a Mk1 will be, I can hardly imagine it powerful enough to make the time in gears so short that it requires a longer final drive? Would it not be better to use the large dollop of power available at lower revs by shifting earlier. Especially when you have a positive displacement charger on there.
Also on an E153, it's still theoretically good for 150mph and cruising at 75 on a corrected rev gauge is bang on 3000rpm in mine.
Aye, it's down to personal preference.
Woodsy and Anth reckon the ST182 FD is gonna kill my performance on the MK1.6 but seeing as they don't drive the fookers much on the roads they don't know jack schitt. :mrgreen:
Some folks like lazy power, some folk like screaming the nutts off them.
Chris, have you still got that exhaust on there? When i changed from the Mk2 NA to the Skytune it made a considerable difference in the way the car felt. It cruised nicer and didn't pull me back as much at cruising speeds.
Yes it's still got the same exhaust and you're right I must do something about it, I like the the look of the skytune but I don't see the exhaust being done before spring, however I will be importing a v6 camry gearbox and swapping the bits into my present 'box (time permiting) then I can put this gearing thing to rest and then the engine and drive will be as it was designed.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.