Economy Dry Sump 3VZ-FE

[wood_patrick]

Right, bear with me here...

After reading through a thread on here for the dry sump kits for the 3sgte, it got me thinking what could be done relatively easily and cheaply for a 3vz-fe to achieve something similar?

Although a rather crude method, what's to stop the sump being extended (making it lower) and the oil pickup being extended to match so that the oil is stored well below the crank?

The standard sump isn't the best on corners to start with, so while at it I could add in some baffles too but the only difference for the engine would be having to suck the oil up an extra 6-7cm which would in turn offer a benefit similar (although more basic) to a dry sump.

At the same time I would probably have to strengthen and reinforce the sump walls as it will protrude and be more likely to catch underneath. Either that or some form of an additional shield to protect it. Also, if extending the sump at the top it would retain functionality of the low oil sensor but would mean that the tip of the dipstick would indicate that the oil is full, so when it starts to show on the dipstick then its full. Either that or reduce the dipstick housing relatively so it's still functional. :-)

At worst if it doesn't work as intended I can just drop the oil, off with the sump and pickup and swap back for standard ones. That is providing it doesn't go bang before then.

[Tommytank]

Why not red bull it?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FORD-PINTO...item2a2e2865ea

[wood_patrick]

Like that idea!

So the one you linked to on fleabay, thats to achieve the same thing then?

Seems like a viable project then. I believe from scouting the interweb that its only going to free up ~10-15 bhp but its still a relatively simple modification for releasing a little more power providing you have access to a welder.

[Tommytank]

I think the RWD style big wing sumps are more for increased capacity. The more you hold the less you deplete the sump when running to pressure, reducing the chance of running dry. guess you could underfill the dipstick and prevent crank submersion, but still run at capacity oil for full pressure....

[snowtigger]

Just baffle it first, extra oil you don't need unless your doing forest stage rallying which is one of the reasons for increased oil capacity.

Baffles for high speed cornering and dry sumps for releasing more bhp and less oil splash and crank oil immersion but expensive.

Reducing your oil capacity will cause major headaches you could do a remote container and weld your sump shallower I've seen it done with verying success as to bhp gains 10 maybe optimistic on a home built system, but never say never crack open the grinder and welder and have a go I say.

I would also fit a low pressure release oil accumulator incase the big ends loose any pressure as a belt and braces approach.

[HurleyRaceEngineering]

Yep baffle first,the idea is to keep the oil near the pick up, so that when cornering it doesn't creep away from the pick up. winged sumps like the link someone has posted tend to be what you do when you want to reduce the height of the engine and still hold the same amount of oil. You won't create much horsepower unless you have the engine under vacuum ie a scavenge dry sump pump. However it is worth while and gains to be had. Having seen the 3v sump it's pretty awful, so any baffling you can do will help

[cdwood2010]

I have a spare 3VZ sump. Somewhere.

:)

[Jiff Lemon]

Here's what Jiff did:

[wood_patrick]

Lots of stuff to think about, but in any case potential benefits to be had...

So, I think everyone's in agreement that the addition of a baffle of some form like Mr Jiffs is a good idea and worthwhile.

Extended sump to reduce the drag on the crank though is debatable on whether it will offer any actual benefits, but it would be interesting to see what gains it actually can offer.

As I'm gonna have a rather enthusiastic slice taken off the heads what I may do is fit the baffle(s) but leave the sump alone. When finished I will get it dyno'd and take a modified extended bodged sump and pickup with me and drop the oil and swap the bits then try again. That way it will give a true reading of what difference it does make. :-) Got a spare sump and pickup so will update on here when I get to it but then I can see what difference the head skim makes and what difference the sump makes.

Sound like a plan?

On the plus, it may also give an idea of what a proper dry sump kit would achieve on a 3vz unless anyone has any idea already?

[HurleyRaceEngineering]

The power you gain from a dry sump is dependant on how big the scavenge pumps are and how bad the engine is in the first place, some engines gain as little as 5 horses where as other engine types gain as much as 20 ( think formula ford's, older alfa romeo engines)

A baffled sump is more for the engines protection and you will see no or little horsepower gain on an engine dyno, same goes for the extended sump as the crank won't get splashed in oil etc with the engine on a bench Dyno or the car even being on the rolling road. There are no corners or lateral movements to send the oil in the motor.

rather than extending the sump you would be better off making a scraper plate to take oil away from the crank, this would be measurable on a very good engine Dyno, but not so much on a rolling road, they simply aren't accurate enough and operators tend to use a lot of correction factors.

I'll see if i can find a picture or one of the ones we do for f3 engines.