Why the 3vz-fe is the best [Archive] - Woodsport Forum & The TB Archive

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Paul Woods

14-10-2005, 07:00

Pasted from the Mr2oc.com 's V6 section,posted here cos its ram packed full of technical spec and upgrade info for the 3vz-fe,this guys knows his onions,a cracking read for us 3vz builders.....

http://mr2oc.com/showthread.php?t=140573

Many thanks to "Toysrme" from mr2oc for this priceless insight =D>

lodgeman

14-10-2005, 09:10

wow that guy knows his stuff- so while my heads are off give them a polish and a porting and i will faster than jb with his ally flywheel:D

Paul Woods

14-10-2005, 17:45

yep thats about the size of it! from what i gather my fancy manifolds are going to be a waste of time too but im still going to make them....he mentions 25bhp available from a Y collector,i presume he means where both banks of exhaust join together under the sump which i cant tell you al is pretty pants on a camry! loads of little gems in that thread though...JB you read it yet?

podge

14-10-2005, 19:21

hi fellas was reading up myself the other day about the 3vz fe and apparently you can put the guts of the engine into the later v6 which is an all alloy block and use the 3vz heads, ill try and find whare it was and post the link, the fellas were also talking about turbo and supercharging the v6 may be of interest oh ye also about a 5vz i think that u use the block and pistons the 3vz crank and rods and youve got 3.3litres? of fun

Paul Woods

14-10-2005, 19:55

14-10-2005, 20:30

Hehe food for thought, must think about rebuilding that other engine. The y pipe looks worth a bit of investigation too.

Paul Woods

14-10-2005, 21:16

yeah i think hes referring to the crap point were both pipes join Jb,it is a bit poo though isnt it,seems to double back on itself.

podge

14-10-2005, 21:34

just looking around and toyota do a 4 liter v6 vvti 256 whatevers of torque at 4000 rpm mmmm me likes

Paul Woods

14-10-2005, 21:49

yep as fitted to the new camrys/solaras in the states,dont know if we are going to get our mits on these bad boys though...

lodgeman

15-10-2005, 02:04

yeah i saw that podge,love to get my hands on a scrap 1mz block (ferret! here boy!) and build it up with 3vz internals and lower the compression ratio right down to 8.5:1...run a standalone and boost the fecker to 15psi or more using a huge turbo...i need 5 numbers and the bonus ball first though mate.

you mean like this?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/New-toyota-short-block-v6_W0QQitemZ8007288400QQcategoryZ33615QQrdZ1QQcmdZ ViewItem

Paul Woods

15-10-2005, 07:50

unbelievable! is there anything you cant find?

15-10-2005, 09:24

=D> Hey Al while you're out and about with your horse and cart can you see if you can pick up 3or4 pairs of steel head gaskets[-o< ;) Be handy by Monday please:p
Yep Paul that's how I read it, improving that join under the sump should be an easy afterswap improvement.

lodgeman

15-10-2005, 16:56

any reason why you couldnt chop around the exhaust to be better. having looked at it could you not cut and turn the back/front one around and join with a 2 into 1 collector and then out int the exhaust?

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a230/lodgeman/exhaust.jpg

or am i being stupid again:p

Paul Woods

15-10-2005, 17:43

lodgeman

18-10-2005, 00:04

if i remove the heat shields to chop the exhaust around will i need to sort out some kind of shielding? would heatwrap be better/worse/useless?

Paul Woods

18-10-2005, 06:16

i think it will be ok without the shields mate,or as you say you can always use wrap or make new shields out of aluminium.

MegatronUK

19-10-2005, 18:14

just looking around and toyota do a 4 liter v6 vvti 256 whatevers of torque at 4000 rpm mmmm me likes

Pfff... 2JZGTE makes 328ft/lb (245Nm) as standard ...

Y'see, what really needs to be done is to twin turbo the 3VZ.....

Paul Woods

19-10-2005, 18:17

agreed,its on my to do list one day,low comp pistons,standalone,tough gaskets,head port,cams,sequential turbos,WI etc etc,i reckon a 3vz could push 500bhp with the right coaxing....of course you can achieve that way easier with the 3s-gte but not the point is it.

lodgeman

21-10-2005, 00:06

no,very good suggestion mate...i think the toyota design here is pants,why have they fed the rear bank back on itself like that? talk about power sapping! yes good idea al,if its routed downstream instead of up it will improve matters no end.

would it make any difference if you had a exhaust box and pipes for each bank of the engine with two exits either side of the rear? would they have to be the same length? the other question is - the cam sprockets that the belt goes on has two slots in the mounting point where it attaches to the cam- would it make much difference if you changed holes-roughly placed on the cam and it was about 3 teeth of the belt different. advanced -clockwise.

Paul Woods

21-10-2005, 06:32

good Q's al....getting the exhaust manifold tubes the same length is actually a critical part of tuning any engine...i think its called pulse tuning if i remember rightly,its very important they all have the same length.

I think if you split the banks into two and had two separate silencers it would certainly work but it would loose that V6 growl,i think it would need a balance pipe connecting the two together,also theres a question mark over the fact that if one cyl fires the resulting exhaust gas travelling past the Y collector for the other bank helps to "pull" the exhaust gas out of that bank,or scavenge it....i remember reading about this somewhere,all very techie....i think it needs to keep the two banks joined but in a more efficient way that it currently is.

Ah now on the cam sprockets! i actually modified a pair of 4a-ge pulleys a while back,i widened the hole that the peg locates in to make a slot,this meant the cam timing and overlap could be messed with in small increments instead of one tooth at a time....this needs RR time though to set them up and im not sure what benefits there are on stock cams,interesting one though.

22-10-2005, 10:08

Yep Paul's right about them alternating pulses. To make it work the two pipes must meet with the same effective length so that the pulses arrive like motorcycle display riders perfectly alternating. I saw one like that on a Lola where the pipes were joined side by side for about 4" and then separated again. Apparently the improved scavenging added 60bhp 10%:-P

lodgeman

24-10-2005, 18:14

i was thinking something like this-

http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2005/10/31.jpg

alter the downpipe by turning one of the pipes around (as per last pic) make that a 2 into 1 and just have either a single flexipipe or a short straight pipe and then back out into 2 again. does that sound about right? thoughts?

lodgeman

24-10-2005, 18:19

paul have you seen the superchager conversion on that v6 mk2- is it practical for the mk1? i saw on imoc that you had spoken.

Paul Woods

24-10-2005, 18:31

grand idea for the exhaust mate,i like it a lot.....as for the v6 mk2,thats my mate phils...the SC will fit our 3vz-fe's too but its got to be imported from USA...he says its more powerful but you cant tell because its taken the ACIS system out of the loop (our version of T-vis) so theres no jolt of power just a smooth progression,so he cant tell its pulling harder.

Im going to leave my sc off until ive roadtested it as it is,i think after reading toysrme's posts we might be on the limit in a mk1,3vz-fe is supposed to have wicked low revs torque.

25-10-2005, 19:21

^^^^^^:bounce:

lodgeman

28-10-2005, 17:40

well i havent got that much to do at the moment as i dont want to go ahead and do the head gasket if we are getting some copper so i started on the exhaust. if you want to know why the exhaust is so restrictive .... look at these pics
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2005/10/33.jpg
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2005/10/34.jpg
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2005/10/35.jpg

no wonder they say that altering the y piece under the engine makes a difference:?

Paul Woods

28-10-2005, 17:54

thats dreadful isnt it mate!! holy crap its lucky to run at all!