View Full Version : Project Black Bob
Well, as you may or may not know, Andy (BlackMk1v6) unfortunately has to give up his car after the engine blew.
Every cloud having a silver lining though, it's timed itself perfectly for me.
So in the next couple of weeks i'll be picking up the mk1a, fully converted, just in need of a new engine. Cheers Andy. :thumbsup: I'm more than happy with the way Andy's done the conversion and the car looks a beaut so hopefully i can finish it off the way i want.
Couple of little rusty bits to sort but that's no problems:
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/07/212.jpg
Not sure on the colour scheme yet but i'll be redoing the pinstripes in a different colour, Azev's will be added, Mk2 leather seats for the interior, possibly some subtle arches as the wheels need spacers atm.
Day1 :
Got my £150 (Don't hate me) Camry delivered and have started taking bits off it, this morning myself and Woodsy got the engine out. (Will get pics on Monday). The previous owner thought the HG was gone but there's no milkshake in the filler and the engine sounds sweet so i'm going to strip it all down and bring it right back to life. Thoughts are it's the thermostat causing the overheating but thankfully the guy has caught it in time. Will be getting new bits anyways as follows :
Strip down, bore and piston check
New Head gaskets
New Water pump, timing belt, most gaskets and rings
Ported heads
fully detailed engine (thinking graphite and red)
Will have it all rebuilt and ready to go for the car arriving 8th Aug (hopefully), and will spend that weekend dropping the old engine from Black Bob, bolting the gearbox, fidanza and hybrid clutch to the new engine, slotting it back in and connecting everything up. (anyone wants to come lend a hand, that'd be sweet :mrgreen: )
The car's already got 10months tax and MOT so it'll be straight on the road and back up to the old yin's house where it'll live.
Plan is to take it to crail on the 17th and see how the new engine goes.
The way Andy's done the conversion, the shell and bits that are on it are the way i said i would always do it 2nd time around. Um chuffed.
F426, the red one, will undergo some final tweaks and i'll put it through the MOT, then methinks it'll be up for sale, or maybe made into a track car, but that's for the other thread.
Will post lots of pictures up this week of the cleaning and detailing process, any ideas on the colour scheme would be much appreciated.
Olie
Good luck Olie... look forward to some piccys..
Good job m8. Will be following this one too :)
Righto, well today was a good day and a bad day.
Got the engine onto the stand and started strippin the mofo
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/30.jpg
Now the main thing with this engine was the external condition of it, it had been sat for a good while and it's a bit manky. The guy said it's had problems overheating and thought the headgasket had gone. I think the problem is more down to having it running on what looks like 100% water.
The thermostat
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/31.jpg
as you can see, foooobared. All the waterways are showing the same kinda crud so it's gonna be a proper flush job on this one.
Water pump was making a grinding noise too so it's getting replaced
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/32.jpg
Thankfully though, good news is the actual internals look minty.
The heads n cams :
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/33.jpg
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/34.jpg
Here you can see the usual mangled HG but it's not impacted the bores, liners or pistons thankfully.
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/35.jpg
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/36.jpg
Still no sure why this happens but you see it on a lot of them.
The bores are bob on too, which is the main thing with these engines, if the bores good, it's gonna be a winner.
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/37.jpg
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/38.jpg
So with all that am chuffed.
Now the bad bits. One of the lower manifold bolts was completely rusted and snapped into the head. Am gonna have to get this sent to a machine shop to get removed unless anyone has any bright ideas?
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/39.jpg
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/40.jpg
Then, i had a clean up of the heads and noticed quite bad wear where the water jackets have been sitting with cruddy water in and corroding the head. What's your thoughts folks, repairable with some chemical metal or do i need new heads?
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/41.jpg
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/42.jpg
Think we have a spare set of heads in the garage so will see what the verdict is and port one set of them.
Need to get a new water pump, belt and a thermoshat on Monday morning but 2moro will be spent cleaning, priming and painting.
Thoughts on the heads though please.
Olie
Would have though that chemical metal followed by a light skim should do the trick m8. However, if you have a psre "good" set, probably better using those instead.
Aye but if i use them then i have to get these sorted to replace them.
Can you put chemical metal into an alloy head?
snowtigger
02-08-2008, 20:33
alloy welding and a skim should sort them had my triumph heads done like that bit pricey but piece of mind out ways the cost of taking them apart again.
Right, well heads are scrap. There's too much damage to them and it would just become a recurring problem , too much to skim off so binned.
Got a spare set of heads there though so will get them ported this week and all bolted back together ready for fitting on Sat/Sun.
Here's my pile of bits all cleaned and ready for priming and paintingc 2moro night.
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/81.jpg
Will be graphite and red methinks, looking like a fairly OEM setup. :)
Ach well, another late one tonight.
Got all the bits and bobs painted up, washed out the crud from the block and got all me new bits for building up over the next couple of nights.
Plan was to have graphite and red bits but there was feck all graphite, so i chucked in a bit of dark green et voila!
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/90.jpg
Am proper chuffed with the results and i reckon it'll look minted int he black bay.
Gonna replace the pinstripes with green ones too. Did this scheme on a mate's 205 a while ago and it looked amazing.
Does look a bit appley mind you lol
2moro nights installment.....porting the heads!
Porting and polishing like a motherlover the now. One down, one to go.
snowtigger
06-08-2008, 20:03
go go go gadget hands go go go gadget heads fecking scunners nicked me heads.
Got them ported n polished good n proper.
Well, ported and polished to what i thought looked better.
Intake has a bit taken out, ports matched and left rough as a badgers. Exhuast i spent aaaages smoothin out with glasspaper, tis like a baby's derierre.
Nae pics as somebody is only gonna give it :
http://www.chortle.co.uk/images/photos/small/harryenfield.jpg
"I don't believe you wanted to do that!"
So i'll leave it till i get the beggar dyno'd and see if av done good or done bad.
Water pump was also fitted 2nite, block and sump sealed and painted. Will give the heads a final clean 2moro and get them nailed back doon.
Got a couple of bits i'll need to nick from Andy's old engine when i take it out but will be ready to rock for Saturday no problemos.
Old engine out and new engine back in in an afternoon? :hmm:
Well that was a long day! Got a couple of hours sleep last night, came into work with a hangover at 12 and got down to business. Well, almost.
Richard picked up the car from Andy, got hit with heavy traffic and i got the car about 3.30pm (Cheers Andy, she's a little beaut!)
Major Marjory thanks to Mr Rob F who stuck out the whole 12 hours with me, fricken great help so he was :thumbsup:
So we got to work, removed the top bits of the engine, then the exhaust etc etc, loom was hard wired in so i had to chop that, will redo that wiring 2moro. Swapped a few parts from the old engine onto the new one and it was ready to rock.
The old engine wouldn't start, overheated and was rattlin according to Andy, so a full inspction will be carried out and this'll either go in the spares pile or i'll do a proper build on it for the Mk2?
Anyways, much later, this happened :
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/113.jpg
2moro will be spent reattachng shit, and doing some wiring.
Start up is still uber imminent :mrgreen:
SlipSlide
10-08-2008, 10:05
Looking forward to hearing this started. Nice and tidy install, other than port and polish are you up to anything else with this one.
At the moment :
ST185 front brakes
Mk2 leather seats
Fitting the Azev's
Redoing the pinstripes in green
For the future :
Skytune exhaust
Longer 5th gear
Mk3 LSD
Megasquirt and a set of throttle bodies possibly.
That's about it, as it's gonna be me dad's car i want it to be a nice, reliable, decently specced pocket rocket.
That i can borrow whenever am back up the road, or going on driving weekends/The Brutalball.
The engine that came out, i have a feeling might just be the HG that's gone so that may end up in the Mk2 shell, if it does, i'll do something daft with that.
Reet, install is done :
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/114.jpg
Got couple of issues though.
1) Wiring still needs redone (will sort that 2moro after work)
2) The driver's side window is down and i can't power it up to put it back up, does the M2 connector have to be connected for the windows to work? I've a feeling it does.
3) Andy had the plumbing a bit different as he had the ISCV pretty much bypassed, it doesn't have 2 of the pipes to loop it into the throttle body and the 2nd water pipe. Not sure what to do with this other than get another ISCV and plumb it right.
4) No cold start injector wiring, but that's no issue as i don't think it does jack shit.
5) There is no number 5!
So not a lot to do and it's on the mofo roado. Gotta swap over the brakes and wheels but they ain't critical atm.
Any help on the window would be ace, thank you please.
Well, as of 9am this morning, Black Bob has been reborn!
Jus need to put the exhuast on and set the timing and we're off.
thrill seeker
12-08-2008, 18:52
better keep bob away from christine ollierotflmao rotflmao
Christine is on the ramps, she can drive her wee heart out if she likes.
Oh wait, she has no heart atm! lol
thrill seeker
12-08-2008, 19:16
thats below the belt :thumbsup:
Arse, damn, bollocks, pish, fuck, cunt!
Had car running, starts pising fluid out the bottom, fookin petrol! Absolutely chucking it out.
So cut off the engine, had a look and the lower bank is swimming in the stuff. Bleedin O-Rings!
NOTE TO ALL SWAPPERS! DON'T REMOVE THE FUEL RAILS, PAINT THEM IN PLACE!!!
So as luck would have it, it's the lower middle one that's pishing petrol. Off with the fannymould, 2 rather impossible bolts on the support bars (fixed firewall on this one), all the pipes, carefully lift off the rear set of rails and replace the o-rings, sure enough the middle bottom one is gashed. Bugger.
So replaced the bottom 3 (you can see where this is going right?) put it all back together, started it up and more liquid!
Forgot to put the water pipe on the throttle body :shhh:
So puts that back on, everything hunky dory. No more leaks. Got alternator lights and no tacho, quick bit of wiring and hey presto both working fine.
About to move the car outside and hear a fizzing noise. Check the engine bay and more bloody petrol!
Yep, top 3 o-rings are about to be replaced.
Man i hate those wee rubber shitey things and that big sharp metally cutting fuel rail :grrr:
Timings done though and zorst is back on :thumbsup:
Wil leave it till 2moro for my first drive, swap the wheels over and get a couple of miles on it before i drive it home on Fri night.
At least my engine's even more clean now eh? :hidesbehi
Glad you're sorted m8. :thumbsup:
All done now, car even drives.
4ft out the door lol
Roll on 2moro evenings shakedown :mrgreen:
Roll on 2moro evenings shakedown :mrgreen:
Your probably shakin bob down like a mofo as I type.:driving:
Can't wait to meet bob at crail. :thumbsup:
That's if he makes it! :angry:
Everything went fine, swapped in new o-rings, took it up and down the yard a few times.
Oh my fucking god, i'm still shaking. I thought F426 was quick but this is just mental. Combination of headwork, exhaust, flywheel and rev1 gearbox just sits perfectly. Am soooo chuffed, my face is all flushed too :mrgreen:
Was fine for half an hour, few runs up and down the yard, stop, check the engine bay, fine. Then as i pulled up to put it away, checked the bay and you guessed it......petrol.
Another fricken o-ring leaking like a motherlover.
So 2moro evening i'm going to have to do things a bit different. Got another rail there am gonna put the other injectors in UBER carefully and put that whole rail and 6 injectors onto the block.
I'm fucking about trying to push the rail onto the injectors while they're still in the fannymould and it's just daft, need to do it right.
So that's my job for 2moro evening, more test driving and then if it's alright i'll drive it up the road.
Am nervous but oh my word i can't wait to get this thing onto the road/track.
Murf, Shugs....be afraid
Be very fucking afraid. lol
Bummer mate. know how you feel twt of a rad stopped my fun. My thoughts exactly Olber, when i was driving mine back from Woodsport last week i absolutely shit myself, couldnt think of a single road where i could really relax and enjoy this thing to its full potential. Will be going to the ring next year but would love a track day at Croft before then if anyones interested.
Fuck aye, Croft is on the cards fairly soon.
Will try and get Black Bob down and take the red un too.
Excellent have you any dates sorted yet? if not i could help arrange as i live nearby
Jus need to play it by ear mate.
Planning to sort the red un in the next few weeks and get it MOT'd and then either sell that and build the Mk2 Track car or take the Mk1 on track. Not sure.
Will defo have to get at least one track day in the red un i suppose.
Well let me know mate, ive got friends with a modded 300 bhp scoobie, a standard supra and a 190 seat cupra chomping at the bit. Would be good to test the water. lol
Test the water? U mean wipe the floor with them ;)
Had more hassles with o-rings tonight.
So decided to strip the lot back and make sure evrything was perfect and i think i've stumbled upon something interesting.
I was using a mix and match of lexus and toyota loom, injectors and plugs, i think there may be a slight compatability issue there but i'll need to do some more research.
Anywho's, matched injectors and rails, replaced all the o-rings, top and bottom and noticed when doing this the injectors slid into the rail and head a million times easier, all put back together and it's now running sweet.
Took it up and down the yard a few times and still fine.
The auld yin insured us through Sky (cheers Double L) with Chaucer for £491 all mods declared, Fully comp with an agreed value and both of us on there. No 3 bad at all!
Drove the car back to the flat tonight and it's just amazing, i've seen at least 4 people drop their jaws already with the noise and performance. :rofl:
The steering is vague as fuck on the front end but there's a poly steering rack bush kit there to fit, so gonna do that, swap on the Azev's for a bit more traction and drive it bhack up to Hamilton so we can head up to Crail on Sunday.
Mega mega chuffed with it. Can't wait to have a proper play in the dry!
Anyone swithering whether to do this build or not, FRICKEN do it. As a package, it's brrrrrrriliant.
:thumbsup: Absolute Brutal Business!
The Veesickness is rife right now :mrgreen:
snowtigger
15-08-2008, 20:55
shaddup your making me jealous as fecking nothing doing now till i get back of me holidays and sort me life out ,u lucky bugger.
Oh dear. Just took it to go get me a McDonalds.
Thank fuck am not driving this thing everyday. I would NOT have a licence.
:high:
millentubby
15-08-2008, 23:11
Olie - come up the east coast and drop in for a cuppa on Sat evening dude.
I'm free all day - you ahve my number.
Would love to see the car...and you of course.
Could do mate, depends on whether or not i can afford the petrol!
Oh my word is it thirsty lol
snowtigger
15-08-2008, 23:52
you don''t build these to save fuel olber if u want to save fuel buy a fiat 500 ,just had a go in the abarth edition with optional sport upgrade 160bhp in some thing that weighs close to a crisp packet fun going slow haha.
oh yes 35 quid on tax as well and 300 quid fully comp.
Oh i know, and it can return good mpg.
If you stay off the loud pedal.
You wanna try that when you're actually in the car though. Fookin impossible!
snowtigger
16-08-2008, 09:44
white and red :slap: :hoarder:
This is my fricken thread!
MON THE HOOPS!
Black Bob after a wee wash and wearing his best shoes.
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/08/161.jpg
Cannae wait for 2moro!
robwsurf
16-08-2008, 19:24
what size and dish are those wheels are they 16" et20 ish looking for something similar at the mo
16" ET35 7.5" wide.
A bit less offset would be nice, scrubs ever so slightly on full lock.
robwsurf
16-08-2008, 19:30
seen some with et20 is that going to fit or is it too little
ET20 will sit out 15mm more than ET35 iirc, so they'll be purrrfect.
robwsurf
16-08-2008, 19:34
one last question will they clear st205 brakes?
That i don't know mate.
Suck it and see methinks. If not, get some of Keri's brakes on in place.
A little update.
Been uber busy at work and with the car back in Hamilton, i've hardly driven it. Did manage to take it on a run to Oban with the PistonHeads mob :
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/10/224.jpg
Car performed brilliantly, surprised quite a few people and it's the 1st proper run i've had in a Mk1.6 on great roads. Absolutely fantastic through the twisties and accelerates like a bat out of hell, jus needs a bit more leg on the faster sections.
Solution is going to be the ST182 final drive when i get round to it.
Only other problem with the car was explaining to people that it had a bigger engine in it. The Mk2 N/A backbox just ain't quite letting the V6 do it's party piece. So, i've ordered a new microphone for the 3VZ. :)
Having looked at and listened to all the options we've had in work, Mongooses, Fujitsubos, Berks, Skytunes, Departure 2's/Japspeed, etcetara myself and the Auld Yin have decided to go for.........
The skytune!
So a Skytune i have ordered. Mr2 system, 88dB, Ferrari chromed quad slash tailpipes, full stainless steel, even comes with a decat pipe.
It'll go pretty much straight on in place of the N/A box and should sound the danglies. Was so impressed with Gidon's, gives that rasping V6 howl up top without being boomy or overly loud. It was a toss up between this and the V8 impersonator Berk but the Skytune should suit the car's future plans better. I said in the beginning this car will be all about the noise and am sticking to that.
Have been in talks with Skytune aswell so watch this space if you're interested in one for your own beasty.
Wheels still need painted and tracking done but the new steering rack bushes have pretty much cured the vague feeling the car had.
Hoping to have the Mk2 seats fitted soon and another couple of little projects done and dusted. Can't wait to hear how this thing sounds when i get to give it some stick.
Plenty pictures and video to come when it's arrived and fitted. :thumbsup:
Hoping to have the Mk2 seats fitted soon and another couple of little projects done and dusted. Can't wait to hear how this thing sounds when i get to give it some stick.
Ah I forgot about the Rev3 seats, if you want them matey, they're sat in my old mans garage in Bradford. It's a 3 hour round trip from work if you travel at a quietish time :thumbsup:
Ah no worries, that's for the Mk2, i'll see next time am down there and pick them up in the sillycar if that's alright.
gidonlamboo
30-10-2008, 18:23
So a Skytune i have ordered. Mr2 system, 88dB, Ferrari chromed quad slash tailpipes, full stainless steel, even comes with a decat pipe.
It'll go pretty much straight on in place of the N/A box and should sound the danglies. Was so impressed with Gidon's, gives that rasping V6 howl up top without being boomy or overly loud. It was a toss up between this and the V8 impersonator Berk but the Skytune should suit the car's future plans better.
Sounds nice. good choice Olie...... And thanks for the compliments of the sound. I'm still very happy with it.
Have fun with it :thumbsup:
I had never even heard of Skytune before we got your car in Gidon, thanks for bringing it to our attention.
You went for the 80dB system, is that correct?
I thought i'd go for the louder one, just for the hell of it :mrgreen:
gidonlamboo
31-10-2008, 12:31
I had never even heard of Skytune before we got your car in Gidon, thanks for bringing it to our attention.
You went for the 80dB system, is that correct?
I thought i'd go for the louder one, just for the hell of it :mrgreen:
Well, Thank you, woodsport guys, for doing that lovely job :jump: :jump:
I have the loudest version...is it the 90 Db version??
But with the v6 is not that loud as an N/A....
I will wait for the pictures and videos...:thumbsup:
stevehall
31-10-2008, 13:38
The heads n cams :
Here you can see the usual mangled HG but it's not impacted the bores, liners or pistons thankfully.
Still no sure why this happens but you see it on a lot of them.
Olie
I'm sure this is a result of the stretch headbolts slacking off the required clamping pressure with age and miles. It'd be great to test two setups, one with MLS gasket and standard bolts, and one with standard gasket and ARP studs.
Top build :thumbsup: , shame about the heads and fuel seals giving you greif.
It was my fault for not doing it right in the 1st place.
I learned after i'd takent he fannymould off 4 times to replace a different o-ring lol
Auld Yin is en route as i type. Will have the Skytune fitted this morning and will get some videos up.
I cannae wait to hear this on song :jump:
Well, that was a shift n a hawf.
Snapped downpoop stud, had to relocate the mid section flange a bit, little bit of faffin about but it's done.
Needs another gasket on the flanges as it's blowing a smidgin.
Just uploadin the video. Had a cracking bit of lunacy in the frost, revving the nutts off it. Dad videod it and only caught the 1st few seconds :doh:
Excuse the crap sound.
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2008/12/19.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v239/OlberJ/Mr2V6/?action=view¤t=MOV00045.flv)
That's the sort of sound that would make me extremely unpopular in my street when I leave for work at 5am......feckin love it.:thumbsup:
that's sounds very beefy......put's a big mac to shame!!! lol :thumbsup:
Marksman
06-12-2008, 20:48
Mighty fine :thumbsup:
Owen.
ukpaisley
06-12-2008, 22:25
That was a late shift ! sounds great, is there a UK supplier for the box ?
snowtigger
07-12-2008, 00:14
night testing now is that so we don't see the skid marks.
That was a late shift ! sounds great, is there a UK supplier for the box ?
Yup, us if you want one. Sole uk suppliers.
A few mods i fancy doing :
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2009/04/168.jpg
- Tinted rear lower lights
- Middle support removed from spoiler
- Wheels spaced 10mm
- Rear diffuser
What's yer thoughts, look good or better as is?
What's yer thoughts, look good or better as is?
If you remove the centre support from the spoiler (I have) ALWAYS remember to shut the boot with your hand on the bootlid not the spoiler.
I removed and smoothed mine and have ended up with a tiny crack where I filled due to forgetting and shutting the bootlid with the spoiler. [:(
I like the other mods, I tinted my repeaters and front side lights black and plan to carry on with the rears. :thumbsup:
Aye i think i'll get some rear lenses and give them a bit of a shmoking.
Either that or find a set of lights that will fit in there and run with LED's under a big red lens.
Not afterburners but rectangular lights.
Anyone think of any that use that setup or would it be cheaper/easier to make my own?
I'm building up some LED clusters that happen to fit behind Mk1 rear lenses :)
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2009/04/169.jpg
This is just the start, I've completed 3 of the 4 units now, just need to buy some more LED's. Afraid I have no photo's of these.
Been doing it more as a learning thing than anything else before moving on to other lights.
http://www.twobrutal.co.uk/forum/images/recovered/2009/04/170.jpg
Basically rectangular ring of LED's for the sidelights and a solid block of superbright LED's for the brake lights. Each lense will have 2 of these in. Also the indicators will be a solid block of amber LED's. I've since changed from useing Vero boards to making bespoke PCB's as it was a pain in the arse to do.
No way chief, are you doing these for someone?
I take it you could have coloured LED's behind the smoked lenses and them work fine?
You can arrange the LED's in whatever pattern you want aswell i take it?
No way chief, are you doing these for someone?
I take it you could have coloured LED's behind the smoked lenses and them work fine?
You can arrange the LED's in whatever pattern you want aswell i take it?
Wasn't doing them for anyone matey, I bought them with the thought that it would be an easy conversion being square for learning on. I was completely wrong on that one, but it's all part of learning. I was going to make them up, and sell them on just to recoup my materials. LED's aren't cheap! lol
Coloured LED's should work fine behind smoked lenses, they are usually a much more intense brightness, and the light should shine through across the whole of the lense. You find with conventional bulbs and tinted lense, the light can only be seen at it's most intense around the filament, the rest of the lense is very dull.
In theory you can use the VERO boards to make up any pattern you like. I was toying with 3 rows of LED's for sidelights, and another row of 3 LED's for the brake lights. This is pretty time consuming stuff though! So now I'm in the process of designing various PCB's to put behind all MR2 lights. I've already got 5 sets of Clear Rev5 sidelights I've been collecting on ebay to install these to. And I'll be working on a set of Rev3 rears when I see a set for sale at a sane price :)
Let me know if you're interested in the Mk1's, I'm not sure if they'll fit in the supercharger lenses but it might be worth a try :)
It's standard lenses i have, not chargers so yeeah i'd defo be interested. :)
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